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Building Rational Expectations for Virginia Democrats

by: FreeDem

Sun Dec 18, 2011 at 23:42:38 PM EST


(Thought provoking, very well informed, thanks for this diary! - promoted by lowkell)

Earlier today, Lowell brought to our attention the enthusiasm gap between Virginia Democrats and our Republican colleagues as we close out 2011 and look ahead to 2012 and 2013. Republican candidates are coming out of the Tea Party woodwork to prepare for statewide runs in 2013, while the Democratic side is silent. I joined the comments to promote discussion of several observations I have on the matter, but I wanted to pull them all together in a diary to get more discussion and throw out some more controversial thoughts.

First, 800 pound gorilla in the room is the Junior Senator from Virginia, soon to be Senior Senator, and former "His Excellency" Mark Warner.

There is a push in the party to get Warner to return to Richmond in 2013 as the only way to reverse the party's fortunes after setbacks in 2009 and 2011. You can see my comment on this possibility here. For this diary I'll just say that until we get a clear statement from Warner one way or another I wouldn't count on the Democratic lead up to 2013 to come alive with announcements.

Next, to borrow from Lowell, "why would any sane Democrat WANT to be governor of Virginia?"  

FreeDem :: Building Rational Expectations for Virginia Democrats
The best case scenario for any Democratic gubernatorial candidate in 2013 would be to win (duh) and have a strong Lt. Governor candidate who also wins and helps secure control of a 20-20 State Senate (without risking any special elections that could cost the party). Picking up control of the House of Delegates isn't a best case scenario, it's utopian! Even the realistic best case scenario forces the next Democratic Governor to deal with a Republican House of Delegates, much like Time Kaine during his last two years.

If the Democratic candidate for Governor wins in 2013 he or she will spend most of the time blocking bad Republican proposals, not building strong Democratic legislative victories. That's just a rational expectation, one that argues that the important issue in 2013 is less about finding the most bold forward-thinking champion and more about finding the candidate who will be most serious about party building in the long term.

The announcement of former Congressman Perriello that he will be working at CAP for at least the next year, if not more, tends to indicate that we won't have much of a choice going into 2013 about finding the most bold forward-thinking champion. So let's now dwell on that point.

To borrow heavily from my comments (See here and here), forward-thinking Democrats should be more concerned about finding a strong champion for Lt. Governor so that we have the best candidate available in 2017 and someone who can spend at least two years at the power table in Richmond brokering deals and ensuring the Commonwealth doesn't entirely go off the rails.

The biggest challenge to Virginia Democrats, one I've conveniently neglected in my comments, is the strong challenge to my rosy assumptions (hopes?) that our party can make steady gains throughout the next decade in the House of Delegates.

In 2001, the first post-Republican gerrymandering election in Virginia, only one Republican incumbent was defeated by a Democrat, when Jack Rust was defeated by Chap Petersen. We lost scores of other seats that year because of gerrymandering. Not a good year.

Two years later, in 2003, not a single incumbent Republican State Senator was defeated (we lost one seat with Byrne's retirement), and only a single incumbent Republican Delegate was defeated (Tom Bolvin defeated by Mark Sickles). We gained three additional open seats and lost another seat due to the retirement of an incumbent.

In 2005, with Tim Kaine winning, we again defeated only one incumbent Republican Delegate (Dick Black defeated by David Poisson). We netted four seats, but this was again due to open seats. And then there was Waddell's race, which I view as a very unusual local situation.

In 2007, when we finally won the State Senate, we knocked off three Republican State Senators and picked up a fourth seat because the Republican primary vote was crazy enough to reject Marty Williams. In the House of Delegates we defeated one incumbent Republican Delegate and picked up three open seats. And Waddell lost.

I don't even need to bring up 2009 and 2011 . . .

The challenge for Virginia Democrats is defeating Republican incumbents, instead of just winning open seats. Our best year was 2007 with the defeat of three incumbent State Senators. We've never managed to defeat more than one incumbent Republican Delegate a year in the last decade!

We did well winning open seats over the last decade, but the Virginia House Democrats need to step up their game if we want to have a hope of becoming relevant by the end of the decade. No one would be surprised by that verdict, I know many in Richmond already feel the same way and are looking for ways to improve their game in the future.

I'll end with these, more far fetched, observations.

Winning in 2013 may be difficult, but I believe that a strong performance by Obama and Kaine next year will show Virginia Democrats that we can chart a way back to statewide victory. In both 2001 and 2005 we knocked off incumbent Republican delegates by combining strong Gubernatorial performance in the district with aggressive candidates. I believe there are a number of Delegate districts where Obama performed well in 2008, will do well well in 2012, are trending Democratic and will favor us in 2013, but are arguably not on the radar of the state party right now. It's important for the netroots to start now in playing a role in recruiting strong forward-thinking Democratic challengers in these sorts of districts.

Virginia Democrats are already talking about targeting the 12th (Blacksburg), 87th (where Kondratick only narrowly lost), and 93rd (Williamsburg). If we were only able to pick up three seats in 2013 I think that would still be a good year, but I think if we work now to expand the playing field it will help the party pick up more seats. Even though we've only knocked off only one incumbent and picked up around three open seats a cycle, we have also seriously contested a handful of other races to ensure the Republicans aren't able to focus all of their resources in just a few seats.

In order to generate further controversy and discussion, I'm going to throw out some names that I'd like to see run in 2013. Please join the list. Consider it a Dream Team.

Bobby Scott.

Phil Forgit.

Aneesh Chopra.

Your choice here!

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Terry for governor and Jon Bowerbank for LG. Strong, progressive. (0.00 / 0)
I think this would be the strongest top two we could have on the ticket. And maybe Chap for AG would be a good choice for AG to round out the top three.

                           T.C.


Why Bowerbank? (0.00 / 0)
I don't understand his appeal. He ran a lackluster campaign in 2009. I couldn't tell you one thing he stood for - and I got his HUGE mail.

And I haven't been impressed with him as Vice-Chair of Finance for DPVA.


[ Parent ]
Bowerbank (0.00 / 0)
I too would be interesting in hearing more from Bowerbank's supporters. I don't share dominic's view of his 2009 campaign, but I'm always interested in what makes Democratic candidates appealing to others.

[ Parent ]
What I said in my comment: He would be strong in rural and urban areas. (0.00 / 0)
I don't know how anyone could have run a more "lackluster" general election campaign for LG campaign that Wagner. And I for one do not believe Jon ran a "lackluster" primary campaign either, he was all over the state, had a campaign office in NoVa and spent a lot of time in both the rural and urban crescent areas. By contrast, Wagner's campaign HQ office was actually in her popcorn factory admin area, and she never really had any urban campaign that I saw even though she lives in Va. Beach. Her mailers were o.k. in terms of emphasizing that she had served in Finance-related positions under two governors, bus she never made a case for why she would be a good LG and be prepared to step in as governor or what she would do as LG to help the Dem. causes. Nice lady, ads on her popcorn bags, but not much substance.

Jon is a successful business owner in Russell County and a BOCS elected member who has won a local election in a pretty R-leaning county, and has created a lot of well-paying tech jobs with his company. He is also one of the most progressive and tech-savvy candidates I know, and very pro-grassroots/pro-netroots.

I also disagree with the (incorrectly) negative comments about his Vice Chair for Finance performance. His Finance Vice Chair report to the Central Committee on the 3rd of Dec. was excellent, much more detailed and more analytical and informative than the DPVA Treasurer report.

There have been comments on BV to the effect that Jon would be a good candidate for the 9th CD race, and I think he would run an excellent and successful campaign. But I doubt that's what he wants to do (although I haven't asked him) and I'd much prefer that he run for DPVA chair when Brian's term expires in 2013. But if Jon does decide to run for LG in 2013, I just don't know who would be a better choice for LG than Jon, so I have mixed feeling about which leadership position candidacy I want Jon to choose - he's too good a progressive, intelligent and energetic person for me not support 100%. Maybe I'm a little biased because I know Jon so well, but if those of you who don't know him personally could get to know him better I think you'd agree that he will be a great leader, and we really do need better leadership at the state level with vision and energy.

                       T.C.



[ Parent ]
My original comment (0.00 / 0)
Wasn't about Jody - so I don't know why you were bringing her up. The original comment was about Jon and FreeDem also wanting to hear more from Jon supporters about why they support him (which honestly, I still find lacking in your response.)

But some people run campaigns out of their businesses to save money, there is nothing wrong with that. I'm also pretty sure Jody had an office in NOVA since she had a regional field director up here - but I could be wrong.

You can disagree with me all you want - we're allowed to have differences of opinions and express them here and thats what I felt like doing, especially since I've seen things from a different POV than most (being on other campaigns.)

Just because someone gets all over the state doesn't mean they are running a great campaign. Hell I was all over the state in 08/09 and I saw Jon everywhere but that doesn't mean I was part of a great campaign (and so was Creigh, Terry, Mike, Jody and Steve - its part of what they are suppose to do to run for office).

I actually like Jon as a person and was disappointed that he had dropped out. I actually saw him the night he dropped out (at the Arlington Dems JJ) and expressed my disappointment to him. However, to me, his campaign wasn't catching on because the candidate wasn't connecting with voters. With him being 'everywhere' and spending as much money as he did, he should have been in a better position in that primary and not had to drop out.

You call him a progressive but why? What is so progressive about him.

And if he is so progressive, and winning in such a R-leaning county (that the Sheriff, CA, State Senator, Commissioner of Revenue, a Delegate and at least 3 other BOCS members are Democrats) than we should be using that as a case study on how we can win elsewhere.  And whats his vision? I couldn't tell you - his campaign clearly didn't leave that imprint on the voters.

Would Jon be good for a 9th CD race? Probably. Will he run? No idea. Could he win, absolutely. But thats all up to him...


[ Parent ]
Dominic, are you a member of the Central Committee ? (0.00 / 0)
I made comments below about why I think you're wrong about Jon, and if you are a member of the Central Committee I do find it hard to believe that you "haven't been impressed with him as Vice Chair for Finance" if you have been attending the quarterly meetings and observed his Finance reporting. His reports are always well researched and his analysis of how the DPVA has been doing with its finances/fund-raising is always very factual and clear, with an honest and clear assessment of how the DPVA is doing with both fund-raising and with how well the DPVA does with how it allocates/invests) the very limited funds (very poorly).

Please do not forget that it is the DPVA chair and his Executive Director, with Steering Committee and Central Committee approval, not the Vice Chair for Finance, who make the decisions about how the party spends the money.

Jon's job as Vice Chair for Finance is to analyze and report the facts relating to how much money the DPVA has and how it tracks with the DPVA-approved budget; he has very little control over policies decisions on how the money is spent. And IMO Jon does his Vice Chair job very well, accurately and honestly.

                        T.C.


[ Parent ]
Quite frankly... (0.00 / 0)
I know how the party works and how decisions are made for spending as I was on the steering committee for two years and the central committee for 3.

But apparently, what you are telling me is, it isn't the VIce Chair of Finances job to raise money, but instead to give a report how its spent and on what? Well color me shocked for all of these years that I thought the Vice Chair of Finance was suppose to raise money for the party (since it isn't maybe thats why the party has no money!). If I'm wrong, then I apologize for saying he isn't doing a good job.

Quite frankly - as a former steering/central committee member the only reason to go to these meetings is to be social and see friends, since as you said all the decisions are already made by a select few. I honestly got tired of the 'blowing smoke up each others a$$es' reports so I stopped going when was I no longer on the committee.


[ Parent ]
Bobby Scott (4.00 / 1)
Is honestly the only name I know on that list, and is it really worth him giving up a reliable seat in Congress to run for Governor when he could very well get his ass kicked by the lunatic machine? A black man versus The Cooch? Won't that just motivate the crap out of the racists even more?

I'd almost prefer Mark Warner resign from the Senate to run for Governor again; He's a disappointing Senator who is not any sort of reliable left-of-center vote, and really, I think if anyone would have a real shot at winning in this type of climate, it would be someone like him.

I don't think it's going to happen, but stranger things have happened, I suppose.


Scott (0.00 / 0)
I don't think Scott on the ticket will motivate the ring-wing any more than having Cuccinelli already on the ticket, and it may in fact help motivate Democrats to come out and vote.

[ Parent ]
Agreed... (0.00 / 0)
The biggest challenge for Bobby is can he put together the type of organization it takes to run statewide and raise the resources necessary.

[ Parent ]
One Point (0.00 / 0)
I agree very much with your point that many Democrats wouldn't want to win the governorship in 2013 with the lineup we now have in the House and Senate. However, a strong centrist candidate (like Warner, but NOT Warner) might have a good chance of winning against the likes of Cooch.

I still maintain that Warner would feel that a return to the governor's mansion was a step down from the position he holds now. He's positioning himself for a run at the presidency, perhaps in 2016 or beyond.

While I personally feel that Terry McAuliffe would be a fine governor, the problems he had in the last primary will still hang over him. Think of what was going to be his signature issue ("I created jobs in Virginia.") His car company went to Mississippi...Virginia didn't even bid for it. His attempt to purchase a bankrupt paper mill and turn it into a viable facility for the production of wood pellets for the European market went nowhere, perhaps because the GOP didn't want him to have a success there.

So, Democrats need to look for a new Warner-type candidate, but not hold out some silly hope that Warner wants to repeat history.

Anyone out there know a very rich guy who can self-finance and who is willing in the present atmosphere to run? Even better, know of a rich guy who also has a strong progressive streak? I know, I'm dreaming again...


So why are you saying someone like Warner, but not Warner? (0.00 / 0)
If you want someone like him, why not Warner? He's the most popular politician in Virginia, still.

I've never been a fan of T-Mac for personal reasons going back to an encounter a friend had with him at the DNC in 2004. I don't get why anyone would think that the person he presents in public is very authentic in any sense. I mean, he fits the mold of the two-faced opportunist to a T. Tell me if I'm wrong.

That said, I don't doubt he could possibly win, but he's got a high downside imo. Failed business deals, consummate political insider, so on and so forth.

If I had to pick the most realistic (as in, with the best chance of winning, not the best chance of actually running) possible trio for 2013, it would be:

Gov: Warner
LG: Bowerbank
AG: Chap!

Connolly could probably win the Gov. race. Northam would also be a good LG pick. And I know he's tried it before and failed, but I'd like to see John Edwards run for AG again (even if that name might be toxic outside of the RRV and NRV).

Head in NOVA, Heart in SW


[ Parent ]
One Reason (0.00 / 0)
I am saying someone like Warner for just one reason. I simply do not believe that Mark Warner would consider a return to the governor's mansion to be in his best interest, and believe me, Warner looks out for his best interest at all times. While he hasn't been able to do what he hoped would be his stepping stone to the White House in 2016 - brokering the magical budget solution for the federal government - he will, I am sure, look for some way to position himself for a presidential run in 2016.

Unless you can convince me otherwise, I see this as Warner's game plan: Retire from the Senate in 2014, spend the next two years running for the White House, and, in his dreams, winning that coveted post. He could sell himself as a self-made businessman, a former governor, and a former Senator. Quite a resume.

By the way, although I have many reasons not to like Warner that much (way too DLC for my tastes), I think he would be a credible president, certainly a giant cut above the flotsam the right-wing of the GOP throws up every four years.


[ Parent ]
Why... (0.00 / 0)
would he give up the seat? Why not show his muscle and run to a possible easy re-election instead of most likely giving the seat up to Republicans?

Showing that staying power would help him in a Presidential primary instead of cutting and running... on top of keeping a plush Senate bank account (read: Federal dollars to be transferred to Presidential campaign).

Warner's biggest problem right now moving towards a Presidential run is...his two most likely opponents, Andrew Cuomo and Martin O'Malley are doing big things as Governors - whereas Warner can't get anything accomplished in the Senate (because it's f'd up).


[ Parent ]
Agreed (0.00 / 0)
Warner will run for re-election in 2014 and win easily, which sets himself up for either a Presidential run or a Veep nod in 2016.

Scott would be an interesting choice for Governor, but I too question his ability to run a statewide campaign against very strong opposition.  


[ Parent ]
Warner (0.00 / 0)
I made this comment in another thread, but I think it's helpful to bring up some observations about Warner and the future.

While Warner is very popular, especially when compared to how unpopular every other politician is right now, he may have reason to be concerned if Obama is reelected.

An Obama reelection, historically, will indicate that 2014 is a bad year. Warner dispatched Gilmore easily in 2008, but he's almost certain to face off against a formidable Republican in 2014. A hostile political environment may not defeat him, but it would be an unwanted distraction if he were serious about 2016.

We all remember how 2006 "distracted" Allen from running for President in 2008.

Second, an Obama reelection potentially narrows the window that Warner has for bipartisan success on his main issue, the deficit. I agree with Dominic's point here.

My reason for raising the possibility of Warner in 2013 isn't just because it's been widely rumored. It's noting that if Warner faces at least one more statewide Virginia election before 2016 why not Governor instead of Senator? At least as Governor he might hold higher hopes of building some sort of legislative victory to campaign on in 2016.


[ Parent ]
I don't see a big difference (0.00 / 0)
between 2013 and 2014 after Obama wins re-election.  Besides, if he quits his Senate job after 5 years to be governor again, how would it look if he quit his governor's job a year early to try and become President?  They calendar just isn't there for Warner to be governor again if he wants to run in 2016.

[ Parent ]
07 was Herring (0.00 / 0)
Just a correction, in 2006 Mark Herring won the special election for Senate and thus was the incumbent that won in 2007 for Mims' seat - not Charlie Waddell.

He's our westernmost NoVa Democratic Senator.


Katherine Waddell (0.00 / 0)
Sorry I was charting the brief career of Katherine Waddell in the House of Delegates. While she didn't caucus with us, it's still worth noting.

[ Parent ]
2013...Where are the Women? (0.00 / 0)
Are there any potential women who might be running statewide?

There were rumors of Shannon Valentine, Jody Wagner and Karen Schultz. Anyone else? Is anyone hearing anything out of them?


We definitely need a woman or two (0.00 / 0)
on this ticket. We also could use an African American, an Asian American, a Latino American, regional diversity, etc. Now, realistically speaking, we won't be able to get ALL of that onto a ticket of three people, but let's see what we can do to broaden this out beyond the same-ol' same ol'.

Follow me on Twitter.

[ Parent ]
Agree, But... (0.00 / 0)
All of the names aforementioned - Wagner, Valentine, Schultz - lost their elections. Perhaps a woman who is in office???

[ Parent ]
Unfortunately, (0.00 / 0)
thats a really small list...Unless you expand it to the local level.



[ Parent ]
Anyone in mind? (0.00 / 0)
I can't think of anyone worthy of a statewide office in Northern Virginia local politics, and names escape me in the rest of the state.

As for those other demos: Luke Torian was mentioned. Might be a good pick for LG to get more diversity out there.

Aside from Walter Tejada, I can't think of any other credible Hispanic politicians. Anyone?

Head in NOVA, Heart in SW


[ Parent ]
Sharon bulova (0.00 / 0)
She has emerged as a good steward and her campaign skills have increased tremendously since the 2009 special.

[ Parent ]
A Fairfax technocrat (0.00 / 0)
I don't know if I see that playing statewide. Same reason why I have doubts about Connolly.

Head in NOVA, Heart in SW

[ Parent ]
Luke Torian (0.00 / 0)
I like the idea of Luke Torian, which I hadn't previously considered, but I think it's about more than just looking for more diversity. Someone with real world experiences in working communities in Virginia would be a strong advocate for our cause.

[ Parent ]
Luke Torian? (0.00 / 0)
Does that guy have a single accomplishment? It looks like he ran 2 lackluster campaigns in 09 and 11. He had very weak opponents both times.

I've heard he likes to go golfing with his buddies instead of raising any money and then expects to get bailed out. That's not going to fly for higher office.

The fact that Luke Torian is being floated for higher office speaks volumes about how weak our party is.  


[ Parent ]
Krystal Ball? (0.00 / 0)
I don't know of any elected/office holding women who are being widely considered for a statewide run.

That argues for better candidate recruitment at the local and district level.


[ Parent ]
Didn't she (0.00 / 0)
Move to NY to be a 'Democratic Strategist' on MSNBC?

[ Parent ]
Yes (0.00 / 0)
I may have been being sarcastic, but I won't tell.

[ Parent ]
Losers don't usually come back to win (0.00 / 0)
I'm all for a female candidate, but not ones who have lost before.  We need the A team in 2013 and except for Tom Periello and maybe Terry McAuliffe or Rich Boucher, all the other retreads should stay out of the statewide contests.  We haven't elected a Dem as AG since 1989 and we desperately need a Dem in that seat.  Since the LtG is suddenly a very powerful job, we need top notch there as well.  2013 is the year to run the best and brightest, not good soldiers who will fight a good fight.  

We need Mark Herring, Chap Peterson, Ralph Northam, Luke Torian, guys like that.  


[ Parent ]
Chap lost in 2005, does that count? What about Mark Warner (0.00 / 0)
when he ran against John Warner and lost? The point is, I'm not sure I'd rule out someone just because they've lost previously. However, it's definitely something to keep in mind, among other factors.

Follow me on Twitter.

[ Parent ]
Also, T-Mac lost in 2009, as did Mike Signer (0.00 / 0)
etc, etc.

Follow me on Twitter.

[ Parent ]
Not a chance (0.00 / 0)
I know Tina wants to be AG, but she is way, way to polarizing to win a contested Democratic primary in Fairfax, much less a contested statewide contest.  

[ Parent ]
Special Elections (0.00 / 0)
How comfortable would you be with special elections for the seats held by Herring, Peterson, and Northam if they were to win?

[ Parent ]
I think.. (0.00 / 0)
Chap's seat we'd be ok.
Northam, uphill battle.
Herring might be an uphill battle - I'm not sure who in Fairfax is represented by the district.

[ Parent ]
If this is going to decide who runs (0.00 / 0)
then we might never find someone, unless they're from deep blue NoVa (which probably makes it harder to carry enough of the Crescent) or a safe majority-minority area (this could work with someone, maybe).

Would we really have that hard of a time in Herring's seat? That area includes some House seats that could have been won with actual effort (the Rust seat for one).

Head in NOVA, Heart in SW


[ Parent ]
Or Not an Incumbent (0.00 / 0)
Maybe we need to focus our attentions, our hopes and our dreams, on people who aren't incumbent State Senators?

The Loudoun Democrats appear in disarray. I wouldn't want to see a special election in Herring's seat until there are some encouraging signs in the county.


[ Parent ]
Well, off the top of my head, that leaves these names (0.00 / 0)
The only ones with much renown that come to mind that aren't in the Senate, have shown some interest, and are in a position to run are:

-Connolly (likely not)
TMac (well, I don't like him, but I think he's also damaged goods if he's not making jobs here in Virginia)
-Ward Armstrong (ha)
-uh...
-wow, we're screwed

Head in NOVA, Heart in SW


[ Parent ]
A couple of other names (0.00 / 0)
Here are a couple of other names for potential candidates:

Kenny Alexander - LG (always rumored to want to run)
Mark Herring - LG/AG (Having viewed Mark from on-the-ground in Loudoun this year - he has cross-over appeal and works hard)
Paul Fraim - Gov/LG - was rumored to want to run for Gov in 2009, but didn't

I'm struggling to come up with other names...


Fraim (0.00 / 0)
A fine candidate. Of course, the fact that he, sensibly, was part of the Mayors Against Illegal Guns Coalition means that the gun nuts who dump piles of money into Virginia elections would oppose him. I can already see the ads showing him with Michael Bloomberg. Sad for those of us who see that group as the sanity among the gun crazies.

[ Parent ]
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