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Sorry, Sen. Webb, But You're Dead Wrong on This One

by: lowkell

Sun Feb 06, 2011 at 14:23:04 PM EST


In the Roanoke Times this morning, Sen. Jim Webb is quoted on the issue of EPA regulation of greenhouse gases. As the article points out, Webb is "among a half-dozen U.S. senators headed by Sen. John Rockefeller, D-W.Va., who have introduced a bill that would delay EPA regulation of greenhouse gases from fixed sources -- such as coal-fired power plants -- for two years." That's bad enough - although, sadly at this point, not surprising - but it actually gets worse. Check this out (bolding added by me for emphasis), followed by my comments on why Sen. Webb is dead wrong on all counts.
Webb, who ran for the Senate in 2006 on a platform that included a better balance between executive branch powers and legislative oversight, said the new legislation is an extension of that.

"When Bush was president, I was very strong on this as far as a lot of the foreign policy initiatives he was taking on," Webb said. "I had the same set of concerns with this present administration, particularly as it goes to their climate area and environmental policies. ... Unfortunately there are people who simply want to do away with coal. Most of them don't live down here."

Webb said the Rockefeller legislation would buy time for Congress to consider the proper way to regulate greenhouse gases, while also helping force the issue to the floor for a real discussion.

As to what a solution might entail, Webb said he's looking for a balance.

"In terms of the country writ large, we on one hand have a lot of different approaches we can take toward cleaner emissions," he said. "On the other hand we also have to protect our strengths in terms of energy emissions and our economy. This is not the time to be taxing our businesses out of the country."

This isn't just wrong, it's wildly, willfully, crazy wrong. If you're interested in why I believe this is the case, follow me over the "flip."
lowkell :: Sorry, Sen. Webb, But You're Dead Wrong on This One
Let me start by stipulating that Jim Webb remains far, far superior to George Allen in almost every way. I mean, would there have been any chance that George Allen would have voted for health care reform legislation? Obviously not. Would George Allen have voted 80% of the time with the Democratic Party? Obviously not. Would George Allen have been supportive on a wide range of other issues, let alone taken the lead to get a modern-day GI Bill passed (or to attempt a reform of our dysfunctional criminal justice system, or to be an expert on defense and foreign policy matters)? No, no, no.

Also, one more point before I explain why Jim Webb is dead wrong in his Roanoke Times comments. The point is simply this: George Allen is utterly horrendous when it comes to energy and environmental issues. I mean, this guy has worked the past few years as a total shill for the worst of the worst, the dirtiest of the dirty, etc. In short, when it comes to energy and the environment, George Allen is heinously bad.

Now, having said all that, let's get back to the main point of this article: Jim Webb is absolutely, 100%, dead wrong on what he said to the Roanoke Times. A few points.

1. The Bush Administration needed to be reined in, for good reason, because it was completely out of control and off the right-wing deep end. The Obama Administration? I strongly disagree that they need to be "reined in." To the contrary, I'd argue that the Obama Administration needs to be pressed to be more progressive, less corporate, less of a continuation of Bush Administration policies, and more about changing things than they've been.
2. As for the balance of power between the Executive and Legislative branches, that's a perfectly legitimate issue in our country and in our democracy. However, when it comes to clean energy and climate, it's utterly ridiculous. The fact is, the U.S. Congress for many years (decades, actually) has abdicated its responsibility in setting a serious, national energy policy. Even in 2009, with a "Democratic Congress" (supposedly) and a Democrat in the White House, Congress couldn't manage to pass serious, comprehensive, clean energy and climate legislation. Let me amend that; the House of Representatives did manage to pass the Waxman/Markey bill, even if it had been watered down and larded up (with fossil fuel industry favors) by Rick Boucher and Company. What followed was Total Senate FAIL. No action. Nada. Not on Waxman-Markey. Not on a mandatory, national, renewable portfolio standard. Not on a power-sector-only carbon cap. Not on "cap and dividend" or other alternatives to the market-based "cap and trade" concept (originally a Republican idea, now bizarrely demonized by the Republicans). The bottom line is simple -- if the Senate was so concerned about its power vis-a-vis the Executive Branch, it should have stepped up to the plate and passed legislation. I know, "what a concept," huh?  Since the Senate utterly failed, once again, in doing so, to hear them whine now about their prerogatives and such is completely insufferable. Give. Me. A. @#@$#$@. Break.

3. Specifically with regard to the EPA, the reason that agency is dealing with greenhouse gas emissions is simple - they're pollution that harms the environment. In addition, the U.S. Supreme Court has made it clear that the EPA not only has authority to regulate these emissions, but that it basically has to ("Under the [Clean Air] Act's clear terms, EPA can avoid promulgating regulations only if it determines that greenhouse gases do not contribute to climate change or if it provides some reasonable explanation as to why it cannot or will not exercise its discretion to determine whether they do"). Bottom line: Congress has failed to act, the Supreme Court has all but ordered the EPA to do its job (which was, by the way, established by Congress in the first place), and now it's long past time for that to happen.

4. With regard to Webb's straw man that "there are people who simply want to do away with coal," and of course they're all from outside Coal Country, that's simply false. Personally, I'm as strong an environmentalist as you get, but if someone could demonstrate to me how coal could truly be made "clean" - not just in burning it, but also in mining it - I'd actually be quite favorable towards it. Why? Because it's a fuel that we don't have to import and that we have huge quantities of. To date, unfortunately, nobody has made coal "clean," nor does that seem to be happening anytime soon (probably decades away, at best), and that's just reality. Given that situation, and given the reality of what greenhouse gas emissions are doing to our planet's environment - and no, you can't wave a magic wand or your hands in the air and wish that away - we've got to deal with that. Pointing at bogeyman who our "out to get coal" or whatever is not serious, substantive, or frankly constructive in any way. Instead, what we need is honest, courageous leadership that's not afraid to lay out the challenges, the goals, and to come up with an achievable path to solving the former and achieving the latter. In the Roanoke Times comments, I'm not seeing that at all from Jim Webb.

5. As for the comment that, somehow, regulating greenhouse gas emissions and setting a strong policy in this country in favor of a transition to clean energy will drive business away from America, that's also completely wrong. In fact, as we speak, America is losing out - big time - to countries like China, India, and Germany in the race for the booming, multi-trillion-dollar industry of the 21st century, ENERGY. Hiding our heads in the sand for a few more years won't just accomplish nothing, it will actively harm our country's businesses as they attempt to compete in this enormous economic sphere of activity. Hanging on to the industries of the 19th and early 20th century is certainly not the way for America to win the economic race of the 21st century, but that's exactly what Jim Webb is advocating here.

6. Finally, with regard to Webb's belief that delaying EPA action for 2 years (or however many) "would buy time for Congress to consider the proper way to regulate greenhouse gases," that's simply laughable. Again, Congress has failed on energy policy, let alone on climate policy, for decades now (e.g., the Kyoto Treaty wasn't even sent to the Senate for a ratification vote). Why on earth would we believe that in 2 years, anything would change in that regard, except for the worse? Let's be blunt: this is not an effort to "buy time," this is an effort to kill any meaningful regulation on greenhouse gas emissions. And that, in turn, is completely unacceptable, based on everything we know about what those gases are doing to our atmosphere. At this point, if you argue the contrary, you are being willfully ignorant, obstinate, and non-productive. That's what the wildly irresponsible Rockefeller legislation is all about:

It is not constructive to block the only working law on the books to curb global warming pollution and replace it with nothing. Blocking the Clean Air Act will do nothing to bring Congress closer to passing comprehensive climate and energy legislation. Rather than fighting global warming solutions, we need to focus on cutting carbon pollution in a way that will spur clean energy investment and reduce our dependence on foreign oil.

This lunacy needs to stop, immediately. And Jim Webb needs to be a part of the solution, not a part of the problem, starting immediately. If not, I for one - and, from my conversations with fellow environmentalists, I think I speak for them as well - am going to have an awfully hard time generating any enthusiasm whatsoever for his candidacy in 2012. Let's hope it doesn't come to that.
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I wonder (0.00 / 0)
how much of this is calculation (like Delaware Senators carrying water for the credit card companies) and how much of it is a kind of emotional identification with the "Born Fighting" people--hardscrabble white folks of Scotch-Irish descent who load sixteen tons, etc.

Webb is a thoughtful guy in many areas (prison reform, notably), but he also has these 'blind spot' issues where logic just isn't on the menu. In a way that makes me like him better than Warner, who would clearly harvest his grandmother for organs if David Broder said it was the bipartisan thing to do. But it also makes me doubt that your very reasonable arguments above would have much impact on him.

BTW, I notice you're not describing yourself as a "Jim Webb Democrat" much these days. :-)


Massive blind spots (0.00 / 0)
including on energy/environment. For instance, his constant insistence - completely wrong - that Iraq plays a major role in oil prices being $100 per barrel. WTF? No oil market analyst believes that, for good reason - Iraq's production today is HIGHER than it was pre-war!!!

Follow me on Twitter.

[ Parent ]
This has been ... (4.00 / 1)
from the first moment, the arena of greatest concern to me over Jim Webb.  

He simply does not get energy, environmental issues, that it is economy & environment, not environment vs economy.

And, well, the only path to opening his eyes is via the national security arena -- until there are Marine Corps generals (retired and active-duty) telling Webb (behind closed doors) that climate change is a serious threat to America, he simply won't get it imo.


[ Parent ]
Right, he just doesn't "get" it at all (4.00 / 1)
but the national security angle doesn't seem to be helping either, as evidenced by his constant repetition of the absolute, empirically demonstrable, falsehood that the Iraq war has any significant relationship to $100 per barrel oil prices.

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[ Parent ]
These days, I'm back to being what I've always been (0.00 / 0)
a progressive of the Roosevelt - Teddy and FDR - type.

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[ Parent ]
Also, how on earth did we get from the Jim Webb in Born Fighting (4.00 / 1)
who wrote this to the Jim Webb we see today when it comes to coal?
The ever hungry industrialists had discovered that West Virginia, eastern Kentucky and southwest Virginia sat atop one huge vein of coal. And so the rape began. The people from the outside showed up with complicated contracts that the small-scale cattle raisers and tobacco farmers could not fully understand, asking for "rights" to mineral deposits they could not see, and soon they were treated to a sundering of their own earth as the mining companies ripped apart their way of life, so that after a time the only option was to go down into the hole and bring the Man his coal, or starve. The Man got his coal, and the profits it brought when he shipped it out. They got their wages, black lung, and the desecration of their land.


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It's genuinely hard to explain (0.00 / 0)
I want to agree with somethingblue above.  When you come from this world, coal is really, really complicated.  You can see things clearly; you can articulate what you know.

But you're born covered in coal dust.  There is a deep ambivalence in you that never quite goes away.  Maybe it isn't possible to explain to someone who doesn't come from there, but it's something that I get, even as try my best to fight against my own instincts on the matter.

Of course, there is also the problem that coal will throw a lot (and I mean a LOT) of money to politicians who support it.  It's incredibly how much money will be spent.  (keep in mind how anemic his fundraising has been)  They've bought and sold Rockefeller and that entire state of West Virginia, Democrats and Republicans alike.  It's literally destroyed people's lives, personal and political.  They have ever reason to try and buy Webb, and Warner too.  Rockefeller caved.  Looks like Webb caved.  Given that Warner went to the "Friends of Coal" rally where anti-Obama shirts were all over the place, I wouldn't be surprised if Warner caves too.

But that's just life in coal country.  The only thing that WOULD surprise me is if someone were able to stand up to coal and actually win.  That just doesn't happen in my world.

It's DIRTY politics.  But it hides behind the faces of thousands of wonderful people.


[ Parent ]
I'd put most of it on the $$$$ (0.00 / 0)
Not to diminish the cultural/human/sociological factors at play, because I'm positive that they exist - just as they do in other sectors, such as agriculture (e.g., wealthy megacorporation ADM uses "helping farmers" as one of their main excuses for receiving large sums of taxpayer-funded corporate welfare), oil and gas( their feel-good commercials are omnipresent, touting how many jobs Americans they supposedly employ), and pretty much every other industry (textiles, manufacturing, automobiles, you name it). The point is, almost every industry generates an emotional attachment by the people who work in it and the communities they live in, but in the end, that doesn't really have anything to do with hard and cold realities such as whether the industry remains economically viable, whether national policy vis-a-vis that industry needs to change for national security or economic or environmental or other reasons, etc. Meanwhile, the dirty energy industries are spending boatloads of money to convince Americans that the last thing they want to do is to start transitioning towards a clean, efficient energy economy.  They're also spending boatloads of money on lobbyists and on contributions - direct and indirect - to the people who are supposed to be representing US, but in many cases are representing THEM.

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[ Parent ]
Clean coal (0.00 / 0)
Whether we delay EPA or not there is not going to be any clean coal within 2 years or maybe 10 years. Alternate energy sources will be required, but who is going to pay?

Definitely not within 10 years (0.00 / 0)
No chance of that whatsoever. 20 or 30 years?  Maybe, but it will still be VERY expensive, and will still NOT be "clean" on the mining end of it at the minimum...

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[ Parent ]
We're already paying (0.00 / 0)
Gasoline over $3 a gallon & natural gas rates in Virginia going up. We're going to pay either way, so why not go clean?

Read more at TheGreenMiles.com and follow me on Twitter

[ Parent ]
Obama Spesks For The Nation (4.00 / 1)
& for the nation's children, for those in areas where incidence of asthma is RISING.  He has to stay firm on this, make clear he will veto it.  This essentially represents backwards steps from where we were.  Kyoto was drafted in the 90's.

SInce Va is part of Obama's re-election strategy, I hope he gets in here and explains to people what is at stake.

Again, next year we will be three election cycles on from Al Gore losing West Virginia because he was some kind of 'Enviro Nerd.'. Virginia is a populous state.  It will probably have 14 electoral votes next year.  Our interests as a populous COASTAL state are served by strong environmental regulation.  


FYI, Virginia's not expected to gain (0.00 / 0)
a seat in Congress this time around.

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[ Parent ]
Coal ain't going away for a while (4.00 / 1)
Regardless of what folks on either side may say, the truth is that coal isn't going away anytime soon.  Webb's line about some people who want to do away with coal is simply shameless hyperbole. There is still a lot of ramp up time needed -- particularly at Washington's anemic policymaking rate -- to get all the other (basically all domestic) power resources going -- natural gas, nuclear, wind, solar, biomass, etc.

So the coal giants may lose some market share and some jobs may move. But it'll be a long transition, leaving enough time for politicians who care to set up programs to help the residents of coal country move on to 21st century options and lifestyles.  The politicians -- like Webb -- just need to get around to that business rather than demagoguing to please Big Coal in the meantime.  

Impeachinelli! Now on Twitter.


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The purpose of Blue Virginia is to cover Virginia politics from a progressive and Democratic perspective. This is a group blog and a community blog. We invite everyone to comment here, but please be aware that profanity, personal attacks, bigotry, insults, rudeness, frequent unsupported or off-point statements, and "trolling" (NOTE: that includes outright lies, whether about climate science, or what other people said, or whatever) are not permitted and, if continued, will lead to banning. For more on trolling, see the Daily Kos FAQs. Also note that diaries may be deleted if they do not contain at least 2 solid paragraphs of original text; if not, please use the comments section of a relevant diary. For more on writing diaries, click here. Thanks, and enjoy!

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